Mobile Industry Review - Latest Comments in The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

bensmith — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 15:59:10 -0000

AJ: Fair comment.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

AJ — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 15:19:51 -0000

I get the point about needing to pay the mortgage and believe me - I am not a socialist - consultants deserve to be paid very well if they can deliver. But when it is a start up involved, particularly where the consultant is supposedly offering to breathe life into a new project, I wouldn't take anyone that seriously if they weren't prepared to agree to some sort of success fee (at least in part). I have been involved in a couple of startups and it is always a really difficult time - in my experience most consultants aren't worth a dime and the only ones capable of any form of delivery are the ones who will discuss success fees rather than upfront payments. It was never my intention to imply that the only form of payment should be equity which would be useful but not very practical. By definition there is not usually that much repeat business where start ups are concerned - it is kind of a niche area. Although telecoms might be different.

Also, you are right about getting a week's work or less for £5k but this guy is offering to work on 5 separate assignments concurrently as well as holding down a full-time job/contract at the same time. Actually none of this is any of my business and I kind of regret passing comment now. However it reminds me of a few consultants who worked for me in a start up I was involved in a while back so I might put it down to unresolved issues. You might be able to get rid of these people quite quickly when it is clear they are not delivering but it is shocking how much money can be wasted in even a relatively short space of time. My main point was that he doesn't come across that well from the post (no big deal - just a personal thing and that's obviously his shtick anyway) and I am more than a bit sceptical that he is capable of any form of delivery given the demands on his time.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

bensmith — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 12:25:38 -0000

AJ: I've been a consultant for ~10 years and my firm has never taken equity (and neither have any of the independents I know - although obviously I can't speak for all sectors). Purely from a cash-flow point of view it's just too slow... you give me a few % of your business today and then I have to wait for you to float or make a private sale... nah... I need to pay the mortgage now :-) Also, bare in mind it's advice being bought - not everyone follows it. The consultant's financial incentive to helping the start-up is the 2nd, 3rd etc engagements.

For someone at this level £5k would get you less than a week of time.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

smstextnews — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 11:33:05 -0000

Generally, yes. I think that's an accurate viewpoint, Gabe. However there
are a number of applications and services that many operators will want to
resell as additional services to their customers. Zyb, for example.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

Gabe — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 11:24:01 -0000

Isn’t it perhaps better to work off-deck first?
Build-up some track-record (users, experience, statistics, and maybe revenue, etc) and then take it to an operator for a portal deal?
Portals are over-run with content that’s difficult to discover. I thought operators were cutting back on small third-party deals and just going with the mainstream, high volume stuff … ebay, yahoo, etc

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

smstextnews — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 10:24:04 -0000

I don't see how charging companies for the benefit of your wisdom is
underhand. I do it almost every day, AJ.

Mr Operator is a wholly independent consultant. Like a lawyer or any other
professional. Yes he works at a mobile operator too and in an influential
position. He can definitely introduce you to the network he works with, but
there's next to no guarantee that'll get anywhere. He's extremely careful
about his respective responsibilities -- as he should be.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

AJ — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 09:56:42 -0000

Ewan: Fair enough - but from my point of view this post seems to come across as a little sadistic, that's all. I have sat on both sides of the table and it doesn't seem very appropriate, texting your mates afterwards to take the piss out of someone, however unsuitable the pitch. Or maybe its the bragging about it afterwards that doesn't seem right.

Ben: Any consultant worth their salt in this type of scenario would charge a success fee or commission, at least in part. Particularly when he claims to be the difference between success and failure. Also, how many months is this likely to drag on for given that the guy has a full-time job and five simultaneous consulting assignments in any one month. Seriously, how much use is this person likely to be. If they can't agree to a cut of some form or another, I doubt they are anywhere near as good as they claim to be. In this sense, the post comes across a bit like a slightly desperate pitch of its own. Like I said, I don't work in the industry but I am basing this on my own experience.

Finally, the £5k monthly charge still seems fairly underhand. I don't know the precise circumstances, but if Mr Operator is a full time employee of an international operator it seems slightly doubtful in terms of his own legal obligations that he should be providing consultancy services on the side at all. This might seem really pedantic, but if he is not taking is day job that seriously how much effort is he really going to put into any of the 5 concurrent consulting assignments he is prepared to take on. Furthermore, I would need more information before I could come to a conclusion but it still comes across a bit like a bribe or at least not very legit. Caveat emptor etc etc - that's all I am saying.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

smstextnews — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 08:54:04 -0000

We've had a lot of feedback from mobile developers this morning -- I hope to
get Mr Operator to give his opinions and some constructive feedback to one
this week.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

bensmith — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 08:43:50 -0000

AJ some consultants do take equity as payment, but not many - why tie your income to the decisions of a start-up that may take years to make a return and/or ignore your advice?

I read this as similar to Dragon's Den... if you make it in front of the man who can make the decision about your app don't come with business cards but not a business plan. Never mind teasing start-ups... it's dumb to chase such a major opportunity only to fritter it away. If you do it's that kind of telling-off should be the push you need to get it right/better next time.

Having said that it would be nice for Mr Operator to offer some positive advice around those challenging areas in future...

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

smstextnews — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 06:50:03 -0000

Ah it's actually the opposite from ridiculing pitchers, AJ. I can see your
perspective though. I asked Mr Operator to do a tongue-in-cheek
illustration of what he faces weekly. I actually found it really
entertaining -- and I got the serious point underpinning the piece: That
many startups just don't stop to think long enough about how to pitch their
app/service to an operator. They get one chance, screw it up ("3 euro per
month, per subscriber, please?") and that's it.

There's absolutely no ridicule involved. I know the chap well and Mr
Operator doesn't take any pleasure whatsoever from turning down startups
who've clearly invested a lot of time, money and hope getting into the
office to pitch in the first place. If anything, the complete lack of
understanding for internal operator motivations and dynamics is extremely
frustrating for Mr Operator. He has to (for example) sit down witht he
startup and explain that the business plan a startup's been working on for
the last years is utter nonsense because no operator on the planet would
accept it. A hugely disheartening experience for all concerned, I suspect.

I'm hoping to change this with regular feedback from Mr Operator.

To answer the payment point: A bribe? Absolutely not! Let's be clear:
Mr Operator is an independent consultant. He works more or less full time
for one particular international mobile network.

If you're a startup, you can also hire Mr Operator to help you understand
precisely what your average operator will want and expect from a deal. I'd
liken it to hiring a financial listing specialist to help you prepare your
company to list on the Stock Exchange.

If your business plan depends on you getting your application or service
into a series of mobile operators across the planet, it's worth a chat with
Mr Operator -- or another similar consultant. Meantime I'm confident the
continuing columns from Mr Operator will add a lot of value to a lot of SMS
Text News readers, many who would welcome an insight into the mind(s) of
your average mobile operator.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

AJ — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 21:35:41 -0000

I don't work in the industry but business is business and the principle is the same. Mr O might get his kicks out of ridiculing pitchers on a weekly basis but boasting about it - now, that's just rude. And disrespectful.

Furthermore, if Mr O was capable of adding real value, ie being the difference between success and failure as described, he would take a cut like everyone else instead of a crappy few thousand quid. Believe me. Actually the way this post is written, the payment comes across like a bribe.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

smstextnews — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 18:41:03 -0000

Set me straight, AJ?

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

AJ — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 16:13:59 -0000

There is something so not right about that article. Talk about being up your own arse. Both of you actually if you want to know the truth.

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

smstextnews — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 11:14:05 -0000

Nice one Jonathan ;-)

Re: The Mr Operator Series: Getting a deal with a mobile operator

jonathanmacdonald — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 04:29:01 -0000

Great article!

Kinda reminds me of the record industry.

----

So you’ve got a few cool songs.

You have sweated blood over it, sold the dog to pay for the instruments, and your partner now refers to you as ‘that guy with the guitar’.

You have a recording desk.

You have agonised over the chords. Your designer friend knocked you up some flyers with a snazzy motif. You have a band name starting with the word 'The'.

You are Ready. White Adidas on, checked the phone 5 times to make sure it’s on LOUD with your best riff as the ringtone, store the record company location in yer iPhone.

You have your album on the web.

You are going to Meet The Man From The Record Company.

The meeting was set up following a 20 second passing blurt at a gig a few months back - you got The Man’s card, and have slept with it under your pillow ever since. You have him on speed-dial, even though you have never spoken since. You have sent increasingly nervous emails suggesting times / places / dimensions where it might be convenient to meet. Finally, there’s a 15 minute slot. You are IN my son. They will love you. Your mates from your local Jam Night are so jealous they can’t snort straight.

You sign in at reception. He’s still on a call with the states, so you wait.

Read NME.

And wait. Read Kerrang. Check your phone’s on loud.

And He’s Here.

Big smile, firm handshake, no business cards, etc etc. Up to the 5th floor, meeting room double booked so you camp out in a spare office. He’s only got 10 minutes now because of a call with Australia, so off you go. His PC goes to your website music page.

Fire up the first song.

The Man asks how many fans you have on the site.

You say 27,000.

He says he can't hear a hit single and as he was too busy to see you live, he wonders whether you have any 'desirability factor' at all.

"Well, we thought your company may help in the marketing of our tunes…."

:: tumbleweed ::

:: crickets chirp ::

:: Fade to grey ::